Jan 17, 2017|
Richard Haass, author of the new book, "A World in Disarray: American Foreign Policy and The Crisis of the Old Order." with Sue Henry
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Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)
Got the laugh and we are very pleased to welcome to our show this morning doctor Richard Haas the author of the world and disarray. American foreign policy and the crisis. Of the old order doctor house the morning. Good morning sue so Griffey beat her and that I see the year in a nonpartisan. Group you're the president of the council on foreign relations so. An umpire and that should try to call on both ways that it's hard for you. But I've been lucky not quite worked for democratic presidential under a Republican presidential. As an outsider I think I've probably done my share of angering people on both sides of the aisle some pretty comfortable with future sports analogy calling it like facing a. Yeah and I think the vasser refreshing in our our in our world today UCE. How each side tries to play the other when you're writing a piece like this a book like this that would. How do you get your ideas across so that we can all listen to what you have to say even if we have a deer and our next turn and. Well I didn't know there was going to be the president when I wrote this book this book was essentially finished over the summer. And I just knew this was going to be the world they were gonna inherit a president can choose sides as vice president countries is cabinet. Country's policy toward them they can't chooses their in box. And what I wanted to do is sit out the opinion about this is not a Republican in box or democratic and boxed it's simply is what does 45 president of the United States shall inherit. And I suggest policies but I think ought to be. Follow the policies I think ought to be avoided. And I don't know you know again these are not them democratic Republican I don't think foreign policy lines up neatly along party lines. The last time you feel that the world was. In order foreign policy wise when using it was at its fast. Results for the president one of the president so I worked for which is George Herbert Walker Bush the 41 president. And he was there he presided over the end of the Cold War. The beginning of the post Cold War Europe system about 2526. Years ago he led the world in dealing with the ya invasion of Iraq invasion of Kuwait by Saddam Hussein. He put together this unprecedented coalition so the way you handle the end of the Cold War the way you handled the first great challenge to the post Cold War world. I thought so at so a lot about the direction of American foreign policy but unfortunately over the last 25 years things have not improved they've gotten worse. Unpacked and it where do you think the word the worst are we in those times now I hope you say now. Ansari. I'm gonna disappoint you know it it is force now and it's cumulative some of the things have just happened. Country's rise countries for all globalization. Way outpaced our ability to contend with that. Things like cyberspace we don't have the the rules of the enforcement. And then we made it worse we made it worse by the 2003 Iraq War. Which helped undermine stability in the Middle East. And Barack Obama made it worse not so much by what he did but more what he didn't do by not acting in Syria when all sorts of challenges forwards on the crushing of the Red Line and so forth. By mandating Libyan and file not following it up. And then more recently. To pivot when we haven't gone ahead and then put into place a trade agreement. That the United States on negotiated and signed. To add all these things up and I I think it's largely increasingly it's gotten worse for both the things we've done things we haven't done. A little bit about the responsibility. Of individual nations to. Take care of themselves. And it in this climate. Know what but my thinking is is that we live in a world where very little stays local for long. If there's an outbreak of disease can spread computer hackers can reach across the world terrorists and either directly or through through the Internet inspire others. If you have a country. Burns coal and large scale that will contribute to climate change. So I think that we need to have a world order I call it world order 2.0. They would Sovereign States also take on the obligation. To make sure that things don't happen within dirt inside their territory that could make the world a much more dangerous or less prosperous place for others. Compact and when when that Donald Trump was running what we know doctor Oz one of his slogans that he used. Was America first now we're seeing. Then there are some things going on around the world to which made G rain dole some of that philosophy do you think. That the transition out of power and some of the things that the Obama administration isn't doing on the way out especially in regards to Russia. Do you think that this will edgy rail America first. Well not exactly sure what America first means I don't think it's isolationist but I think it it seems to have a lot to do with that we're gonna make our decision on what narrowly seems best for last. I think we have to be careful about that we have benefited enormously from stability in Europe which in turn. As you know has been the result of NATO the European Union so we have to temper American first with the idea that we can't withdraw from the world. And we can't simply dictate to the world we need partners so I'm hoping that the administration. Defines what comes to define America first in a way that that reflects the realities that the United States can lead but we need others to work with us. Is Vladimir Putin's a partner. For the most part know he's been a threat to stability in Europe. Obviously in Ukraine he's been a threat to stability of the Middle East to commit at all sorts of atrocities there in his. Military engagement on behalf of the Syrian regime. I don't want but I don't wanna ignore him I don't want to isolate him I don't want to humiliate him. And I think selectively we could possibly work with them but only when we only when we make it clear that he will not be able to succeed if he continues to one of the things I would recommend. As we continue to add military forces to the NATO countries. But our neighbors of Russia. I don't want to base American farm policy on trusting mr. Putin I would simply give him realities that the unit he'd done faster react to. Other partners do you think that the incoming president might have around the world who are some individuals can you believe he should be. Reaching out to in order to. Assessed that there needs it and their partnership. And that we can develop with them at Sutter who do you think he should be on the top of this is his list. For outreach. Good question I think it's somewhat varied depending upon what challenge what part of the world so in Asia. You've got allies say South Korea Japan Australia. And since South Korea Japan won't be particularly important for dealing with west North Korea. In in places like Europe obviously Germany took also France and Britain. Italy Poland is the most important countries. In Europe in the Middle East since Israel with several of the Sunni. States for dealing with the challenge of our Iran or or terrorism. So then what we have to do is just fine partners around the world of organ adopt witnesses is different combinations of partners. For dealing with different global issues are different regional challenges. With the Brack said and then Donald Trump for some people believe that more conservative policy is is a foot in the world. Gee see the world as becoming. A bit more conservative and I know on some of the European countries they are about to have a elections are changes in power so well what do you think. I don't think it's conservative electorate anymore what's conservative with it could cost you what I see is more disruption. And that's the opposite of conservative conservatives wanna preserve institutions preserver arrangements they're wary of change but I don't see that in mr. Trump's outlook and announcing that a what you read some say is doing in the United Kingdom with. With Greg said I don't see that in some of the populist or nationalist forces afoot. In Europe sold actually worried that this is not a conservative here but this is becoming a radical or disruptive to Europe. And who from where I sit. Most of the potential change to be. Tires. Associate potentially much more negative. And send positive. I don't see people prepared to put into place arrangements that will help keep the peace shall promote promote prosperity. What is your opinion. Fled the secretary of state did to be if it is so Rex Tillerson what do you think about them. Well I know Rex told city comes to the job with the enormous global experience also a lot of management experience. I simply say though that the biggest question about whether secretary of State's succeed. Has less to do with the individual that's obviously important. But it does put the president. And the president has to make sure that the world perceives that the secretary of state speaks with authority. Represents the president represents the United States and the administration. So mr. trump have to make a commitment. That there's no daylight between him and Rex Tillerson otherwise Rex Tillerson won't be able to be effective. What did you think about a John Kerry's performance as the secretary of state. Well and I admire how hard he worked at it. I was not a tremendous sand of the Iran agreement I think that was an example of we knew we got an agreement but one we want it too much. And we settled more than we had to. I also would not. Dedicated the time to the Israeli Palestinian issue that he did or the way he did it I simply didn't think it had much promised. Let probably would've spent more time. Both in Asia trying to promotes stability that I deal with North Korea but also more time at home. It's a funny thing to say about the secretary of state. But I think secretary of state now has to spend considerable time and home. Having the conversation that you and I are having yourself a little bit about why the world matters. Now what the role of the United States is just what I'm beginning to worry about is we're seeing more more Americans. Question why the United States has to stay active in the world question in the door to desirability. Of free trader or what have you saw. I would hope that mr. Tillerson. Will will probably spend more this time outside the Middle East and we'll spend more this time at home. As your perception of the influence impact and power. Of I aces slash I assault. Well it's considerable what's gonna happen is it is going to lose its control over territory in places like Iraq first and then Syria. I think Jenna will become more scattered more like a traditional terrorist group LLC it to terrorism around the Middle East I'm afraid we're gonna see a lot of that in Europe. We'll probably see some of it here in the United States. These groups are not going anywhere so whether it's called ice sister aren't so all right I'll Qaeda or you name it. I think we're going to have a number of these individuals have a number of these groups for the foreseeable future in the and so on this is now part of the this is not part of the architecture of our existence it's unfortunate but it simply reality. Where are you hopeful this is the last question a lot of hostile. I do CIT group bought the US economy has the potential to grow. I see hope in the Western Hemisphere where I think. While people are turning their backs more more populism we're seeing some strengthening of democracy. I see hope in India soon to be the world's most populous country growing at over 7% I think there's real hope there but I haven't given up. I'm places like Asia so I think there's there's there's two reasons to be optimistic about fatalistic we've also dove just we also got to be realistic. Don't give up don't ever give up that's our philosophy at doctor Richard Haass what a pleasure to have you on the show today and I'll one of our. With techsters said that they are mostly through your book and they couldn't wait to hear your son blanket so much they're fans out there already in Hampshire there's more now a world in disarray American foreign policy. And the crisis of the old order what of what a wonderful interview thanks to do and it. Thanks for having me.